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budowono1
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Hamja is the Priminister Of Republik Indonesia.
but i am confinced of his guilty part in the bombings and other anti indonesia pro arab actions by islam extemist.

i do not have fysical proove but im sure of it.
for the last 1,5 yrs i have been observing hamja's activities and it turned out quite negative .

Abu bakarclaimes the one that gave him orders and even paid him to kill Ibu Megawaty was non other than priminister Hamja has.

i know these are cerious acusations but all points of my researce proven positif on his invluence.
that was why it was Hamja that did not want abu bakar to get releaced it was Hamja to have people like Imam Samudra to been given the highest of hight punishment to whipe away his tracks and infolved ment but Muktar pakpahan spoke and also sayd that it was Hamja that threatened him and his family.
these are actual events when i have fysical evidence i will precent it but till than i can only tell you what i know....!
I won't Make such cerious acusations if i wasn't 100% sure wich i am pleace dont lock this to pic or leave sarcastic remarks .


if any one could help me with my researce and help bring down this dangerous manHamja haz than i would really apreciate it
THAT IS ALL I HAVE NOTHINGELS TO SAY..............!!!!



Jeroen
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I guess it's better to see it as a theory as long as there are no proven relations and there is no evidence.



xtrapol
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This is an excerpt of an interview by an ABC (Australian Broadcasting Corp.) journalist with Hamzah Haz on 25/10/2002 after the Bali Bomb:

quote /*

Voice-over: According to information gathered by US Intelligence, Abu Bakar Bashir has been at the centre of a network of terror linked to al-Qaeda throughout South-East Asia. At the height of these allegations, Vice President Hamzah Haz has met publicly with Abu Bakar Bashir and other militant groups, appearing to give them his backing.

Evan Williams: The world looks at this and again thinks that you're protecting Islamic militants - Indonesian Islamic militants - in the country.
Hamzah Haz, Indonesian Vice President: I must shelter and cultivate all the potential elements. We can talk with them, we can approach them and we can try to understand what they fight for. Then after we talk, they won't have any destructive ideas.

Voice-over: Before the Bali bombing, Vice President Hamzah Haz insisted there were no terrorists in Indonesia. After the bombing, he gave this extraordinary justification for that position:
Hamzah Haz, Press Statement: If I as vice president said that Indonesia has terrorists, no one would come to Indonesia, no investors would come.

Evan Williams: In light of Bali, that would seem a reprehensible comment, if you knew that people were here.

Hamzah Haz, Indonesian Vice President: It's not true that I protect them and I don't regret what I said, but I said it in the past - it relates to the past. But now if there is a connection we want to know whether it is true that Indonesia has a terrorist network.

Evan Williams: After the bombing, do we now say there are terrorists in Indonesia?

Hamzah Haz, Indonesian Vice President: This is precisely what has been proven. It was clearly terrorists who perpetrated this attack. We now need to establish whether there is any connection with terrorists links inside Indonesia.

*/



xtrapol
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Just to balance this out a little.... the journalist used "US intelligence" as evidence for Hamzah's relations with fundamentalist factions.

But hey.... look where "US intelligence" got us.... see Iraq for details.



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Hamzah Haz? this is actually an old issue but i personally think this is just rubbish. don't get me wrong, i am not a fan of mr haz but all i know he is an opportunist, not a terrorist.
having any relationships with people suspected as terrorists will not do his political career good. you see, right after failing the first round of presidential election, he soon announced that he's all behind megawati. don't you get it? he's a safety player. he will not risk his reputation or liability by fooling around with the wrong crowd.
guys, this is too early to point fingers at anyone. Emoticon:


Slightly older, hopefully wiser, absolutely prettier

xtrapol
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Yeah, you're right. He is a safety player. Even that interview excerpt shows that. I'm not out to prove Hamzah Haz is responsible for murders. Partly because - if he is - there will never be any proof to justify it.



budowono1
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actualy im working on it to find more effidence .
i am 100% sure and so is Muktar Pakpahan the man who's live he ruined.

don't u think that it's strange that Abu bakar colapsed minites after he mansioned Hamja haz his name.

I didn't say that there is no terorist network but the socalled conection between Al-Qeada is bull shit Western Media and Us Goverment is so upsessed with al-qeada that they see al-qeada in every islamic group wich is wrong this is a regional group but they do not care toknow the truth for instance CNN clames that Abu Sayaf is conected to the chain of evenge if they would have done more reasurce they would have known that Abu Sayaf is a Liberation fighter and his motives are not to distroy the non arab world but independance in a from a Christian comunity cause the Moro people have been victom of mas racism and kilings in the past cause of there beleefs and religion.

same for Jamaah islamya wich is a Local group grown out to a regional group wich was largely funded by PPP the group of
Vice-Precident hamja Has
and motives are to scare away all westerners from Indonesia for yrs of rape plundering and serpresion.

And they have existed since the late 70's it was Jamaah Islamya that blew up a Armory near Pasar Minngu in 1984 and where also responcible for the killing's of more than 150,00 people at the Tanjung Priok murders in 1984 but Suharto denied it from happening that they returned after 17yrs is cause Suharto is gone now and his law and word with it .
for there was a special police unit of from Menpor
(Resiman Pelopor) who went out on unofficial misions and asasinated islamicfundementalists but in 2000 they returned and rebuild having large fundings from hamja has.

you can find aboud this in old POSKOTA articles and in official police records. i can not find the proof to his colabaration but is i have i am going to get him.

but the point is there are no real international links none at all
the western politicians see Al-qeada in every islamic group but lost there perspective to reason abd should first look over the motives instead of poiting the easy finger that is all i have nothing more to say



Aangirfan
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Laskar Jihad - run by the security services.
Omar al-Faruq - agent of the security services
Fathur Rohman al-Ghozi - agent of the security services
Kommando Jihad - controlled by the security services
Jemaah Islamiah - linked to the security services
Al Qaeda - an invention of the security services

"This (9/11) was all planned. This was a government-ordered
operation. Bush personally signed the order. He personally
authorized the attacks. He is guilty of treason and mass murder." -
Stanley Hilton, Bob Dole's Chief of Staff





diederick
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In a recent video Oslama bin Laden claimed very proudly the attacks on 9-11. Or is he also a person linked to the security services? Or is he maybe also member of the 'satanic circle" .
This Stanley Hilton is clearly a megolomaniac. There are all kinds of vultures around looking for prey around the 9/11 attack. You know the joke. What is the best thing that could happen to the world? Answer: 10.000 US lawyers on the bottom of the sea.
Question Aangirfan, is there anything or anyone out there in the world acting in their own right, without pushing, interference or whatever. Or even better. Are you controled by the security services?




budowono1
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What security service with the world crazy like this the point is aboud serfiving.
and i am out to distroy former primnister Hamja haz.
he's going to pai for all of is crime's and treason to the great Republik.
there will be no interfearance of the west cause they are to buissy chasing ghosts.
i coulnd care less aboud 9/11 our people suphered more than them did u know that in a month time 12times as much people died In Indonesia than in the Vietnam War and all cause of america so sorry if i dont sympatice with people that dont know mercy not even to children.

they think that every one who is muslim and is fighting are linked they don't know the motives and don't know the reason they are to obcesed to even care.
they think that one Arab atack them that all islam is same.
For instance there is no conecction with al-qeada and MILF
Abu-sayaf is fighting for indipendance cause for years his people have been discriminated and murdered by the christians in the philipenes and wan't indipendance he is a liberation fighter.
and Aceh has nothing to with al-Qeada Aceh started before the Republik Indonesia even was.
it all started with tengku Umat . and than Cik ditiro and now
Hasan Ditoro it are difrent motives.
the hatred for Australia has nothing to with them helping the War criminal Gusmo but with them atacking Indonesia in 1942 and in 1948 with Australia beeing arogant and insulting Indonesia Goverment and militariy. the hatred we have for the west is cause these murdrish bastards kept on killing our people years after the colony with no reason at all they send a CIA pilot called Allan Pope to bomb kalimantan they killed Soekarno they are the cause of all the chaos in the world so yes i beleef that it is all there work.
of the Sculs&Bones organisation they don't hasitate to kill inocant people in the past why think they won't do it agayn ???
think aboud it read history than you'll see what i mean




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