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Wilders endangers his fellow countrymen all over the world

Many are waiting for the moment - unfortunately a big part of the people is only waiting for it for negative reasons - the short move made by Dutch politician Geert Wilders about the Koran, the holy book for Muslims. He wants to show the world that Islam is a religion of violence and that 'their book' - the Koran indeed - is a source of fascism in the religion. That is the very short story and I'm sure other aspects of Islam will be highlighted as well. It is expected that that won’t be too positive as well, which is causing that negative feeling. Such a kind of straight-forwarded attack on Islam - or any other religion for that matter - will provoke strong reactions and these will not be limited to the area that we know as The Netherlands.

Continue reading , click the title




searching
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I wonder why people ALWAYS write like this:

"Such a kind of straight-forwarded attack on Islam - or any other religion for that matter - will provoke strong reactions and these will not be limited to the area that we know as The Netherlands."

This is a blatant lie. Many films have described Jesus as gay or other things. And so what? Please don't HIDE the fascism of Islam by camouflaging it with "strong reaction". They simply want to kill everyone who question or critisize their books.

Is it a normal and acceptable things to always succumb to their TERROR just because of FEAR? If yes, why don't you all convert to Islam. They will fight until all the world is Allah's.


Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

Yerun
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Why should my opinion be a lie? Don't really understand it.

Who is 'they' in your story? I haven't met any of 'them' (which I suppose is islamic people) that want to kill me. I have only refused to meet with a few that had a poster of Bin Laden and Abu Bakar Bashir in their room, because I felt intimidated by it.

Act of free choice it was, no fear or whatsoever, because I have the strong belief (oops, wrong word here) that this kind of things will be leveled out at the end, by 'their own people'.

If the entire world converts to Islam, there will still be the problems we see today, as there are many groups that claim their islam is the only one. Just like with those other religions in the world.

What are you trying to say man?


Ho Lee Fuk

searching
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The title has been a lie. It's not wilders who endangers you, but the muslims' outrage by the assertion to be made by wilders and their decision to make a collective punishment, like they usually do.

I do apologize to call it a lie. Perhaps you don't even realize that it's a lie.

"or any other religion for that matter "

This small additional hypenation, is also another false statement. Today, it's only Islam and the poor people brainwashed by it (called pious muslims) who will react 'strongly" (even kill). They are the group who issues fatwas for everything.

I am just feeling tired that the media, trying to soften and in fear of seeming to "offend" the "softhearted" muslims, choose to include "any other religions", or "the angry youths". Why can't you, the journalists, write a spade as a spade? The freedom of speech is dying because of terrorism and if we succumb to what they want (show respect, say things that they want to hear), well, THEY win.




Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

Jantje
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Searching wrote:
The title has been a lie. It's not wilders who endangers you, but the muslims' outrage by the assertion to be made by wilders and their decision to make a collective punishment, like they usually do.

Searching, i agree entirely.
I expect Wilders is about to show a film about the Koran and its ancient implementations in this day and age. Showing how it may inspire people to commit barbaric acts. If it shows the truth, what’s wrong with that? Should we fear the truth and should we play down the threat of sahria and fatwa in Holland and therefore just get along with this?
And what about releasing members of the “hofstad group”. According to the judge this is not a terrorist organization. The Dutch incompetent lawmakers and the constitution need a drastic overhaul. Not Widers but this ancient religion and its primitive rules are a threat to democracy, in Holland and the world.
If moslims don’t feel comfortable in Nederland they should leave the country and practice their religion elsewhere. Not laying down the law in their guest-country and sponge on society.
As I said before: this multicult isn’t an asset but a burden on the Dutch society and its economy.






searching
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"Searching, i agree entirely."

Jantje, thanks a lot.

"I expect Wilders is about to show a film about the Koran and its ancient implementations in this day and age. Showing how it may inspire people to commit barbaric acts. If it shows the truth, what's wrong with that? Should we fear the truth and should we play down the threat of sahria and fatwa in Holland and therefore just get along with this?
And what about releasing members of the “hofstad group”. According to the judge this is not a terrorist organization. The Dutch incompetent lawmakers and the constitution need a drastic overhaul. Not Widers but this ancient religion and its primitive rules are a threat to democracy, in Holland and the world."

If only people get rid of their 'politically correct' notion and start to see this truth, the world will be a better place.

"If moslims don't feel comfortable in Nederland they should leave the country and practice their religion elsewhere. Not laying down the law in their guest-country and sponge on society.
As I said before: this multicult isn't an asset but a burden on the Dutch society and its economy."

I don't know about this. But multiculturalism only exists when all the cultures admits that all the cultures ARE in the same level, and no culture tries to dominate other cultures. It can't happen to Islam, because in islamic teaching, Islamic culture is the best and they want to dominate the world. As simple as that.


Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

searching
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the ancient history of Indonesia shows the danger of Islamization - they pretended to be all peace loving, but when they come to the power, they were merciless.
I think no Indonesian understand HOW Majapahit was ruined, because it was not written in the history. They never learn WHAT Kian Santang has done to Prabu Siliwangi, his father. They never learned about WHY the temples like borobudur was found BURRIED. Because learning about that will show the evil of Islam. The Indonesian history books always say that Islam come to Indonesia and was spread in peaceful manner.

If Europe doesn't learn from this, in the near future they will become Islamic as Middle Eastern.


Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

sidia
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On 01-02-2008 06:12 searching wrote:
I think no Indonesian understand HOW Majapahit was ruined, because it was not written in the history. They never learn WHAT Kian Santang has done to Prabu Siliwangi, his father.

They never learned about WHY the temples like borobudur was found BURRIED.


Do you know then ?
Pse tell us.

Also abt the Sundanese part , I am curious because I am Indonesian, moslim, partly sundanese with Galuh roots.

terima kasih


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

sidia
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On 01-02-2008 06:12 searching wrote:
If Europe doesnt learn from this, in the near future they will become Islamic as Middle Eastern.


Yes indeed , but you forget to mentioned Cordoba and Constatinopel .
And as we know the turkey are coming to Western Europe as a new member of the European Community. Emoticon: Smile
More than 70 .000.000 moslim will be the new European citizens.
What about the numbers of Moslim in the Netherlands , France , Germany ?
They are allready among us . Emoticon: Nice


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

JohanN
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The bullshit of the so called problems with religions is keeping alive by stupid postings like this and the stupid replies on it by people who can not do anything at this issue anyway.


Begin de details te vergeten

sidia
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On 01-02-2008 14:15 JohanN wrote:
The bullshit of the so called problems with religions is keeping alive postings like this and the stupid replies on it by people who caby stupid n not do anything at this issue anyway.


Is keeping alive with posting and stupid replies .
Yes , indeed Emoticon: Party!


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

searching
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The Prabu Siliwangi was chased by Kian Santang, his son because he refused to enter Islam.
As a sundanese, have you ever wondered that you never listen to this history?

www.pikiran-rakyat.com/cetak/0303/27/0324.htm

"Yes indeed , but you forget to mentioned Cordoba and Constatinopel .
And as we know the turkey are coming to Western Europe as a new member of the European Community.
More than 70 .000.000 moslim will be the new European citizens.
What about the numbers of Moslim in the Netherlands , France , Germany ?
They are allready among us ."

Not yet. The Europeans are starting to realize the danger of Islam. We also will fight to let them know, to encourage them to read more on Islam from the Quran and Hadiths. We need MORE information on Islam so we know the real Islam.

"The bullshit of the so called problems with religions is keeping alive by stupid postings like this and the stupid replies on it by people who can not do anything at this issue anyway."

The stupidity only lies in a people who think that death FATWA againsts people who express different opinion on a certain religion as something normal, or Sharia punishments as something normal, while in fact the muslims WANT to apply it, even in Canada, Europe, etc (the last time one of the imam in England 'offers' Sharia Law to England).


Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

sidia
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On 02-02-2008 17:16 searching wrote:

Not yet. The Europeans are starting to realize the danger of Islam. We also will fight to let them know, to encourage them to read more on Islam from the Quran and Hadiths. We need MORE information on Islam so we know the real Islam.

".

Are starting to "realize " because of Mr Bush. Or after 9-11.
The Moslims are living more than 40(fourty) years in the Netherlands.
And even more longer in France.
They always live peacefully with the dutch or the french.

If you need more info abt Islam , pse read the Al-Qur' an.


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

searching
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Sidia,

Have you read what happened to Prabu Siliwangi. If you are a sundanese of course you know him. But have you ever learned in INDONESIAN HISTORY that he was chased by Kian Santang his son because he refused to convert to Islam? answer with yes or not.
I myself, I never knew that until I read in internet.

"Are starting to "realize " because of Mr Bush. Or after 9-11.
The Moslims are living more than 40(fourty) years in the Netherlands.
And even more longer in France.
They always live peacefully with the dutch or the french.
"

Are you trying to fool yourself? Live peacefully. Then whom do you think making the French riots. And how about the brussel incidence?

"If you need more info abt Islam , pse read the Al-Qur' an. "

Al Quran, and ahadiths, of course. Can you understand Al Quran without ahadiths? Al Quran is NOT sequential, and was compiled based on the lenght of verses. without ahadiths like Bukhari, you may NEVER know how to do 4 of the 5 pillars in Islam.
IF you read only Quran...hahaha, have you read Surah Al Taubah? Beautiful, isn't it? (in sarcastic mode).
I have a politically incorrect guide about islam and the crusades. If you want, I can send you so you can check and learn about it.


Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

sidia
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On 03-02-2008 06:52 searching wrote:
I have a politically incorrect guide about islam and the crusades. If you want, I can send you so you can check and learn about it.


Political incorrect guide . ?
You have name it by yrself ,its incorrect.

Of course you must read it with the eye ,the brain and knowledge and the context of the 21 century .
Otherwise you will think and act the same as some of fundamentalist . Emoticon: Smile


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

searching
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Sidia,

Politically incorrect means it's not politically correct - means it's designed so it's politically acceptable.

"Of course you must read it with the eye ,the brain and knowledge and the context of the 21 century .
Otherwise you will think and act the same as some of fundamentalist "

Agree with that. So are you saying that the practice prescribed by Quran and ahadiths by the example of Mohammed are not applicable anymore in the modern world?

If so, then I am relieved to find a muslim like you. Hope all muslim will become like you.


Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

sidia
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On 04-02-2008 05:13 searching wrote:


*So are you saying that the practice prescribed by Quran and ahadiths by the example of Mohammed are not applicable anymore in the modern world?

**If so, then I am relieved to find a muslim like you. Hope all muslim will become like you.

*No , depends yr own choise. We are free to make a choise.
Dont forget , most of the moslim in Indonesia are abangan.
.
Imho people in the west are not friendly against the moslim and islam .
Because terorist action from some of moslim.
Its better if that they fight against the terorist , but they (the so called western) make a big mistake to fight Islam and they forget the people , the "abangans" behind the Islams.

** Be careful , maybe I am not a "good"moslim.Or a "fundamentalist" , not a purist.
But take for sure that I always have my right to defend myself , my belief etc


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

searching
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"*No , depends yr own choise. We are free to make a choise.
Dont forget , most of the moslim in Indonesia are abangan."

I don't get what you mean. You can see the social practices in the era of Mohammed (raping Prisoner of Wars, etc) are not acceptable by modern value. So what choice do you mean? You can choose to practise or try to impose the sharia to people, but it means that you are no different than the terrorists like Osama bin Laden. What's the difference?

"Imho people in the west are not friendly against the moslim and islam .
Because terorist action from some of moslim."

People with different culture always have some kind of 'culture prejudice' against others. The same thing happens that people in Arab Saudi are not kind to pagans and to kuffr just like me. The difference is that in the west the law protects you against racism (please keep in mind that Islam and muslim is not a RACE).

"Its better if that they fight against the terorist , but they (the so called western) make a big mistake to fight Islam and they forget the people , the "abangans" behind the Islams."

The value of terrorism lie deep in the teaching of Mohammed, as we can see in Quran and Hadiths. I have quoted the verses long time ago in a discussion with you: "Slay the unbeliever whereever you find them" is written in Quran, and scary enough this order has NO time limit, and it's not abrogated because they are among the latest verses. In the history, we know that it was the time Mohammed gained power and started to spread Islam by sword.

"** Be careful , maybe I am not a "good"moslim.Or a "fundamentalist" , not a purist.
But take for sure that I always have my right to defend myself , my belief etc "

You can defend Islam, I don't mind that. All I ask is a decency to accept the proofs I mentioned long ago, that Islam is not really a peaceful religion as some politically correct people try to convince us. And Mohammed's hands were fulll of blood of innocent people that it's hard to believe a real God will choose that kind of man as a prophet.

Please don't defend Islam by terrorizing people not to questiion it, and keep issuing death fatwa and threat. It only proves that Islam is not a peaceful religion and cannot reason decently.


Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

sidia
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On 05-02-2008 04:54 searching wrote:
Please dont defend Islam by terrorizing people not to questiion it, and keep issuing death fatwa and threat. It only proves that Islam is not a peaceful religion and cannot reason decently.


I only use my right to defense myzelf(family) and belief.
Its a universal right. And I think that the moderate moslim or the abangans in indonesia will NOT go after the unbeliever(who are they)? and slay them with golok.We are living in 21 century.

It is yr choise if you wil read theQur'an , hadith etc like some people and some moslim(terorist) .They are slaying with goloks , fighting again the " other " side .
Its not my choise , and I am sure also not the choise of the abangans, Islam KTP etc.My other fellow moslim.
But take for sure I will fight back if someone attack me .


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

searching
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"I only use my right to defense myzelf(family) and belief."

Who wants to harm you or your family? And to what extent you want to defend your belief? To the extent of killing other people who say that Islam is not a peaceful religion by showing you the proof from Islamic Sources?

"Its a universal right. And I think that the moderate moslim or the abangans in indonesia will NOT go after the unbeliever(who are they)? and slay them with golok.We are living in 21 century."

So it means that you believe some of the verses in Quran are out of date? I sense so, but at the same time I also feel that you are really attached to Islam. Why? Have you ever checked the verses I gave you?

"It is yr choise if you wil read theQur'an , hadith etc like some people and some moslim(terorist) .They are slaying with goloks , fighting again the " other " side ".

So if someone doesn't read Quran and hadiths and do what is prescribed there how a muslim knows how to behave as a muslim? You get me confused. A believer will do what is prescribed by the holy book of the religion he believes in. Or is it not the case?

"Its not my choise , and I am sure also not the choise of the abangans, Islam KTP etc.My other fellow moslim.
But take for sure I will fight back if someone attack me ."

I am glad on that. But once again what do you mean by "attacking"? The problem is the islam KTP are those who seldom read Islam and are not really into Islam. And most of them are good people, even better than some other religions' believers.
It's the pious muslims that we must be afraid of. Abu Bakar Basyir, Imam Samudra, they are really into Islam.
But every muslim has a potency of becoming Abu Bakar Basyir or Imam Samudra, when they stay muslims. There will be time when they are afraid of death or others, and want to be close to heaven and think that doing what is prescribed by Quran and Hadiths will save them.

That's the potency that I would like to diminish, by engaging as many people as I can into this dialogue.


Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

sidia
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On 05-02-2008 11:31 searching wrote:
Thats the potency that I would like to diminish, by engaging as many people as I can into this dialogue.

Dialogue ? Only dialogue , to understand what or who the moslims are ?

I am a moslim , living in the Netherlands for decades.
We have always live in freedom and peace with the Dutch.
Since 9-11 and a crazy action of a moslim terorist in amsterdam we (the moslims in general) get problems with some crazy people like Wilders .

He is attacking Islam en Qur'an .
My personal opinion , if people want to live peacefully with me and my fellow (moderate )moslims in holland , is O.K.
We respect the Dutch Law , we are for the time being guest in Holland.
But if they insulting or attacking us instead of the moslim terorist , then we have a problem . We have also our right.
Wilders cs must work with us(the moderates,) instead attacking all moslims or the qur'an.


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

searching
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"Dialogue ? Only dialogue , to understand what or who the moslims are ?"

Dialogue to reveal what Islam really teaches. Not the kind people want to believe. That's why some people really hate me in this site.

" am a moslim , living in the Netherlands for decades.
We have always live in freedom and peace with the Dutch."

Have you ever thank the Dutch Law for that? Many people don't have that priviledge living in countries with sharia laws. The last information I have women in Atcheh must wear jilbab.

"Since 9-11 and a crazy action of a moslim terorist in amsterdam we (the moslims in general) get problems with some crazy people like Wilders ."

When you start to think that somehow muslims also must relfect and consider that some of the treatments they have is the responsibility of muslims? Of course you know the concept of Ummah. That's why some muslims in Indonesia will scream to defend Palestine while they close their eyes even to the bali bombing.

"He is attacking Islam en Qur'an ."

He is attacking values of Islam written in Quran. He is not harming you or anyone else. So do you think he deserves to die or any dutch must die because of that?

"My personal opinion , if people want to live peacefully with me and my fellow (moderate )moslims in holland , is O.K.
We respect the Dutch Law , we are for the time being guest in Holland. "

Good for that.

"But if they insulting or attacking us instead of the moslim terorist , then we have a problem . We have also our right.
Wilders cs must work with us(the moderates,) instead attacking all moslims or the qur'an. "

Who is atttacking you? Wilders wants to tell us something about Quran. Does he attack you? Why you think so? Do you think the muslim terrorists also attack you for "misleading people" into thinking that Islam is not peaceful? But why you are angry with Wilders etc? Why you, muslims, don't get upset with terrorists and start to help the police in finding them, cooperating with them in revealing all the acts not in accordance to Dutch Laws?

So far, you, moderate muslims, are silent. You scream for Guantanamo, for Palestine, but you are silent when the victims are not muslims. With your double standard why must we feel guilty of revealing that Quran doesn't teach us on peace, but instead, on WAR and on doing what Allah wants (i.e. dominating the world?).










Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

searching
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Long ago, I mentioned a pool on muslims in England that a big percentage of muslims will NOT betray fellow muslims, even if the muslims are engaged in terrorism activities.
Do you mean that they ARE also terrorists? No, they are all moderates, just like you, with a great sense of Ukhuwah Islamiyah.


Find out the real face of Islam, read www. faithfreedom.org

sidia
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On 06-02-2008 11:33 searching wrote:
Long ago, I mentioned a pool on muslims in England that a big percentage of muslims will NOT betray fellow muslims, even if the muslims are engaged in terrorism activities.
Do you mean that they ARE also terrorists? No, they are all moderates, just like you, with a great sense of Ukhuwah Islamiyah.


I dont know who they are , and its not my problem . Emoticon: Smile



Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

marcel70
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sidia,
This is your problem because they give a bad name to the islam.
But just by giving this type of statement it shows how big the problem is.
The moderate moslim like you say you are ,dont care what happend.


This is a big problem the moderate moslim if they care and they know something they should go to the police.
Why they not go to the police?
Citaat: from moderate moslim:I dont know who they are , and its not my problem .

wassalam


Becik ketitik olo Ketoro


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