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Aangirfan
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The latest discoveries in Quantum Physics suggest that Dukuns may be correct about the nature of things.

In 1982 an experiment was performed by a research team led by physicist Alain Aspect in Paris.

The experiment showed that tiny particles that are far apart are able to communicate in ways that cannot be explained by the transfer of physical signals.

Many physicists, including David Bohm, regard these connections as absolutely instantaneous.

In Bohm's view, all objects and events in the world are temporary things, derived from a deeper wholeness. Bohm gives the example of a flowing stream:

On this stream, you may see an ever-changing pattern of ripples, waves, splashes, etc., which evidently have no independent existence as such. Rather, they are arising and vanishing in the total process of the flow.

Another example Bohm uses is the hologram. A remarkable feature of a hologram is that if a holographic film is cut into pieces, each piece produces an image of the whole object.

Bohm suggests that the whole universe can be thought of as a kind of giant, flowing hologram.

Bohm believes that life and consciousness are found in all matter, including supposedly "inanimate" matter such as electrons.

He suggests that there is intelligence in matter, so that new evolutionary developments do not emerge in a random fashion but creatively as relatively integrated wholes from implicate levels of reality.

Bohm believed that the general tendency for individuals, nations, races, social groups, etc., to see one another as fundamentally different and separate was a major source of conflict in the world. It was his hope that one day people would come to recognize the essential interrelatedness of all things and would join together to build a more holistic and harmonious world.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~





Albert
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Aangirfan,

Can you please give me the Url of the above message.

Maybe there is more background info or other interested stories/links.

Thanks
Albert


Wil je ook meester van je eigen leven zijn? http://www.goudenera.nl

Aangirfan
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Aangirfan
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Hi Albert,

You might like these articles about God-

There are two fundamental errors which are often made in thinking about God. The first (and worse error) is that God is "out there". The second (and better error) is that God is "within".

http://www.serendipity.li/god.htm


Prof. Ze'ev Herzog of Tel Aviv University announced: "the Israelites were never in Egypt, did not wander the desert, did not conquer the land, and did not pass it on to the twelve tribes". Moreover, the Jewish God YHWH had a female consort - the goddess Asherah!

http://www.rumormillnews.com/c(...)forum.cgi?read=42815









Albert
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Aangirfan,

Thanks, I will have a look at them.

Albert


Wil je ook meester van je eigen leven zijn? http://www.goudenera.nl

budowono1
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Some Dukun good Some bad .
it depence if u beleef if u don't spirit can never come to heal u,

some one can go 20 time to lo Sinsei banteng but if not beleef it will not work



Makassi
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I beleive that the dukuns, as well as all other 'holy' men are using the energy that surrounds us all. Menkind's ability to heal themself is affected by that energy. The energy of one can 'communicate' with the energy of another one. It can be transferred to another one. Blessing, healing hands (Reiki), eating, drinking and so on, are ways to transfer energy.
Energy can be positive, but also be negative. It can be blocked, but not by not beleiving it, but by an active and positive awearness.

May your God be with you.. Emoticon: Worship



Sepp Buys
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Aangirfan,

The text is too long and maken it more confusing than it already is. Too many names and identities, but still a good peace to think it over. There are so many books written so many theories. We must believe what is good for us. In harmony with all. Respect even the the tiny bits. It is all very very interesting.





Aangirfan
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Terimah kasih



Desi Clark
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Dukun can be a physician, can be a psychic, can be a magician.. can be a midwife (?), what else can they be?








Effort and Courage are not enough without purpose and direction.

Albert
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Drunk?? Emoticon: Stupid Emoticon: Bye bye


Wil je ook meester van je eigen leven zijn? http://www.goudenera.nl

Pardi
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Dear Desi.
A dukun can be very dangerous, aviod them as much as possible.
In the last 10 years I have seen unnecessary people dying. I admit that in most of the cases the patient don't have money to pay the doctor, or go to a hospital. My fiends wife had breastcancer and money enough, but here family want here to see a special dukun in Jakarta, the result see died. See and here family had money enough, if not their fam have, see was a cousin from Sukarnoputi the president of Indonesia. In Holland the doctor told here to have a quick operation assoon see come back to Indonesia. See had 4 children...........lett him go to hell this dukun they sey to me.....and they like to kill him, I told them, that don't bring your mother back. Let your sister write about this things, see and your farther are Journalist and inform so the people, about the danger.

salam Pardi
sorry fore my english I never learn it ad school. Emoticon: Nooo



Aangirfan
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Pardi's English is good and he is correct to warn about Dukuns.

Yes, some Dukuns are dangerous! When someone gets typhoid or TB it's essential to go to the Rumah Sakit PondokI Indah, or similar. I know of people who have died as a result of visiting Dukuns rather than hospital doctors.

However, I met one dukun, in the hills above Bogor, who was particularly good at setting broken bones. And another dukun was good at foot reflexology.

And I can think of several government hospitals, such as Cipto, which are best avoided. The third class childrens ward at R S Cipto is a national disgrace. I have come across a number of patients in government hospitals who were dying because they were not getting any medicine. And if you try to meet the director of a government hospital you may find that he is 'away on the Haj pilgrimage'.



Pardi
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Aangifan thank you fore your reaction.

I lost my adoptet son in R.S Harapan kita in Jakarta he was 19 years old. The problem was not that I cant find good docters to do the operation, but the problem was that everything after his operation gad wrong. After his first operation back in the hands of other docters and nurses everything go wrong. But my son servive with the help of the cadiolog and the torax and hardspecialist. Aftrer he left the hopital he look okay. 10 day's later he begame sick again and everything went wrong, they told me he need a small operation fore about 20 minits. He had a litlle water bihind his long. This 20 minits take all togatter 3.5 hour, and he came back from the operation room nearly dead, during his operation they dont have medicins to give, so their are a lot of complications. Back on IC unit and later in the patient room they start stolen his medicins and he diet. I know they commit eutenesia on him. They have stolen fore about 20 thousant dutch guilden medicins. This I know from the apotic, they warn me that this medicins maby are stolen in the hospital. Because they are suprise about the amount of medicins I buy, and ask me fore howmany patient I buy, I told only fore one. they say you can be sure they are stolen. I also know it from one of the docters in the hospital, and also from his cardiolog who speaks dutch and study in Holland. But this infomation came to late, one day later my son diet.

I don't know if you undertand duch, but if you like I sent you my rapport

Salam Pardi





Lovely
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As long as you belive in God and we have God always be with us, there is nothing can defeat God's Power.

Dukun still can die.....



Aangirfan
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Hi Pardi,

I knew several children die in government hospitals. After one child died, it became clear that the staff were intending to pocket the money I was due to pay the hospital. In the same hospital, a patient I had brought to the hospital disappeared. A patient also disappeared from a hospital in Bogor. There were many cases of patients not being given any medicine.

Government hospitals should be avoided, if possible. R S Cipto and the Red Cross Hospital in Bogor are possibly the worst. Harapan Kita has a problem with patients picking up secondary infections.

On the positive side, may I recommend R S Atmajaya (very cheap)
and R S Pondok Indah (more expensive) in Jakarta.




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