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AnisJ
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A short while ago we are witnessing some statements in his 'pre-electorial appearances' with 'accessorial speeches', lately he was referring to 'good old colonial times' of the Dutch VOC.
At that time the NETHERlands, as one of the European backward countries become rich by being a 'save heaven' for Dutch pirates that raided rich Spanish vessels returning from their rounds of plundering South-Americas gold and silver, these raiders are sometimes assisted by their English collegues .......
So when this Dutch prime-minister , as I h'd understood being an educated university man, is making such statements he actually is degrading himself.
  • "Does the prime-minister has any historical knowledge about the Dutch colonial history ???"
  • "What does he really meant by making such statements ???"
  • "Is it 'electorial bla 2 ' or what ???"
  • "Does he knows, as a member of a Christian political party about the historical evidence the Dutch VOC played in 'slave-trade' and the monopoly policy it played in 'the spice-trade' , with unsavourly practacies by the use of 'excessive acts of violence' ".

    For instance, in the Moluccan archipelago of Banda, the indigenous population was almost totally massacred, because they refused to contribute to the monopoly spice system the Dutch VOC wanted to inplant; the diminished population that was left, was exiled by the Dutch VOC to the main Moluccan island of Ceram .......this was the first registered 'act of genocide' by a first global Dutch 'multi-national', representing Dutch spice trade policy in the Asian part of the world !!!


  • 'Mr. prime-minister, please next time, before making such statements "think first", for a 'culpa' afterwords is not good enough or an 'ik betreur' .......





  • 'Ahu kura ahia, mansia nia'

    Jeroen
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    I moved the topic to 'Other talk'... once again.

    Yerun



    Dutchess
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    Hongaren duiken VOC-schip op bij BraziliŰ

    Amsterdam, zondag 29 nov 9:07

    BOEDAPEST - Hongaarse duikers hebben dichtbij de Braziliaanse kust het wrak gevonden van een Nederlands vrachtschip dat ruim drie eeuwen geleden zonk. Dat meldden Hongaarse media zaterdag

    De vlag van de Vereenigde Oostindische Compagnie (VOC) wappert op de replica van het VOC-schip Amsterdam. ANP PhotoVolgens expeditieleider Attila Szalˇky verging de zeventiende-eeuwse driemaster Voetboog op 29 mei 1700 met 109 bemanningsleden en een peperdure lading. Het schip van de Vereenigde Oostindische Compagnie (VOC) had onder meer zijde, specerijen, thee, porselein en ongeveer 180.000 Nederlandse gouden dukaten aan boord. Die objecten verkeren volgens de duikers in een goede staat. ''De totale waarde is ongeveer 1 miljard dollar'', omgerekend 670 miljoen euro, aldus Szalˇky.

    Volgens Szalˇky was het schip vanuit Batavia, het huidige Jakarta, richting Nederland vertrokken. Vermoedelijk kwam het schip op de Atlantische Oceaan in een hevige storm terecht. Door via de Braziliaanse kust te varen hoopte de bemanning wellicht veilig thuis te komen. Waarom het VOC-schip voor de kust van BraziliŰ toch verging, is niet duidelijk. (ANP)

    bron: Parool




    wablief?

    oyibo
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    Dutchess this topic is in English.


    It's only kinky the first time.

    guna2
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    On 29-11-2009 14:29 oyibo wrote: Dutchess this topic is in English.

    Dear Oyibo, I seriously hope you do not classify AnisJ's postings as `English'. They are `Dunglish' at best. Pretty bad Dunglish at that.



    petbar
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    To Anis J :
    I am curious where and when Mr. Balkenende was referring to "good old colonial times of the Dutch VOC ". I can hardly imagine he has used these words. Referring to Dutch pirates, do consider we were at a state of war with Spain, our war for independance, so no pirates but just conducting the war at sea.
    VOC and the spice trade in the Moluccans, by today standards indeed that were criminal acts, not to be proud of, just like the Puputan in Bali 1902 and the theft of Lombok treasures. By the way why is Indonesia not asking these stolen treasures back?
    But don't forget the Dutch were only able to rule over ID islands with the help of local raja's and sultan's , who treat their own people bad and mosly more bad.
    And pse look to modern ID, around 1967 a million Indonesians were killed by fellow Indonesians, and even in 1998 3000 people killed in an uproar mostly against the Chinese part of the population, who lived already for 100 yrs. in ID just like my family. Hundreds of young Chinese woman were raped, sometimes mutiple raped by Javanese hero's. No official investigation yet conducted.
    And you can read everyday in the Jakarta Post abt. the corruption scandals of high governement officials, and don't forget the bizarre war of KPK officials with the police, who apparently forged false aquisitions against them, only due to strong protests of young Indonesia the true has come out, totaly false!!!
    And a coward president who has decided to stay at the sideline, instead of using his power, typical Javanese behaviour! Allthough I must say immediately he is one of the best you ever have.
    So Mr. Anis, let us both work hard to improve our tanah tupa dara. In 2 weeks I will kiss ID ground and my Sundanese teman hidup.
    Salam,
    JPF Barneveld Binkhuijsen ( si Peet)



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    bisa dicek of makemyday .

    petbar
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    Thanks to Mr. Surya Atmadja I have heard now the statement of Mr. Balkenende. He said exactly "let us rejoice Dutch can do it again, the VOC mentality accross the borders with the dynamicity. " So not. I repeat not, he was not referring to good old colonial times, that is a lie from you Mr. Anis. I insist on your correction and apologize, if you have any manners!
    But still an unlucky remark of our PM, which I regret. But I am not responsible for it.
    But indeed you can have a certain degree of admiration for the Dutch, who sailed from 15 000 km. away to the ID islands, and ruled them with a few 1000 man and the help of the raja's and sultan's, and lost underway half of the man aboard.
    But pse forget these quarrels, let us work together to a better Indonesia without corruption and nepotism. I call on all my Indonesian brothers and sisters!
    I realy hope to stay the last years of my live in our country, if not to much visa problems.
    Salam,
    si Peet
    JPF Barneveld Binkhuijsen



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    On 30-11-2009 20:42 petbar wrote:
    Thanks to Mr. Surya Atmadja I have heard now the statement of Mr. Balkenende. He said exactly "let us rejoice Dutch can do it again, the VOC mentality accross the borders with the dynamicity. "


    Heh ?
    the Prime Minister, Jan Peter Balkenende, announced: ôLet us be proud of our country, back to the VOC mentality!ö (The VOC = The Dutch East India Company and thus colonialism, oppression and the slave trade). And the only criticism in the press was jokey and lighthearted. And the man has been re-elected. Meanwhile many Dutch history books still euphemistically call the bloody suppression of the Indonesian independence movement against Dutch colonial rule: police actions necessary to restore order.

    Nederland kan het weer ,die VOC mentaliteit etc


    bisa dicek of makemyday .

    Dutchess
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    On 29-11-2009 14:29 oyibo wrote:
    Dutchess this topic is in English.


    I am so sorry. Ok here it goes specially for the majority of english speaking members here.. Emoticon: Devil

    Hungarian divers find 17th-century Dutch ship near Brazil


    Budapest, November 27 (MTI) - A team of Hungarian marine archaeologists has found the wreckage of a Dutch cargo ship which sank near the Brazilian coast over three centuries ago.

    Voetboog was a three-mast flyboat, which left the port of Batavia (now Jakarta) for The Netherlands with a 109-member crew on board, the expedition leader Attila K. Szaloky told MTI.

    Owned by the Dutch East India Company, the Fluyt ship carried silk, spices, tea, Japanese and Chinese porcelain as well as nearly 180,000 pieces of Dutch golden ducats. The estimated value of the wreckage is about 1 billion dollars, he said.

    Sailing on the Atlantic, the ship was probably caught by a storm and its only chance to get home was to stick close to the Brazilian coast. For reasons unknown, however, it sank near the coast of Pernambuco state on May 29, 1700.

    The team of Octopus Association for Marine Archaeology found the wreckage in October 2008 but announced the discovery only after the first phase of examinations came to an end. The objects found in the depths suggest that it is indeed the wreckage of Voetboog which is lying on the seabed under several metres thick of sediment. Over the past 309 years, the ship has virtually disintegrated, Szaloky said.

    The finds will be brought to surface and conserved in line with Brazilian law.




    wablief?

    petbar
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    He?, Mr. Surya,
    May I refresh ur. memory. The so called ID independance movement started with raping and killing innocent Dutch, Indo and Chinese woman and young girls. No nation can let that pass without reaction!!! So the war started.
    You have changed the subject of this discussion from the unlucky statement of Mr. B. to the ID strugle for freedom. And I don't know of any governement elections recently, ra ra?

    = edit: offtopic removed =

    JPF Barneveld Binkhuijsen



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    Double Dutch Emoticon: Yes!

    PS : its not my own words , its a quote from a site.


    bisa dicek of makemyday .

    Jeroen
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    Offtopic removed. I am not sure where you want to go petbar, but going offtopic doesn't help you as a newcomer. I suppose you understand that. People that asked to be banned (you did twice now) will be getting my full support without hesitation.

    So, ontopic now and keep the personal and mainly unverified crap away from this forum. Thank you.




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