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Makeup led to woman's branding as prostitute
Every humiliating moment of that day is etched in Lilies Lindawati's memory. She still smarts at the indignity of being branded a prostitute as she stood before a jeering crowd in a "show trial" for Tangerang's new prostitution bylaw. "I felt like I was being raped in front of those people who laughed at me after the judge ruled I was a prostitute, simply because the law and order officers found a makeup compact and a lipstick in my bag," a tearful Lilies told The Jakarta Post in her rented home in Tangerang.
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Jeroen
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Nice, those local bylaws Emoticon: Talk to the hand I used to hear this from f*cking Iran



londoh
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Is this an opinion ? Or just remarks from someone who just woke up and did not drink his cafe yet Emoticon: Clown



Jesses
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This bylaw suits the local police very well, of course. Just fine any girl/woman who seems to have paid some attention to her looks. Easy money...



Jantje
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It will take generations for these agama maniacs to think rationally. Maybe never happens. I'll ask my avatar to make some inquiries over there. Emoticon: Nice



belgianguy
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I think we gonna be reading more and more horror stories like that
sharia bylaws are already in force in 18 regencies across indonesia
the main problem is that those laws affect everybody, also non-moslims
how about this one: in padang, a local sharia bylaw requires all schoolgirls to wear the jilbab, also if they aren't moslim!
the town I live in (in east java) is also moving in that direction
a fanatic moslim minority is imposing its will on the silent majority
it's just a matter of time I guess



Jesses
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They're just a bunch of cowards and hypocrits. With all these 'noble' ideas they have about improving morality they just try to purify their own soul. They are bargaining with Allah.

It's the same everywhere: I live close to Bunschoten-Spakenburg (black stockings) and have worked there for some time. Recently, a project developer tried to build a disco or something over there (maybe it was even a brothel). "No, no," everyone shouted, " It will attract prostitutes and other low lives." So, the plan was cancelled.

Shortly after this debate, it came out that the youth who worked in the fishing-industry where actually paid in coke ! (cocaine, I mean, not cola)

Meanwhile, one of the main features of Bunschoten-Spakenburg society, is the continuing competition among no less than 7 different types of churches. So, how can we ever take seriously any 'moralistic' debate within such a society.

O, by the way. There is an Afghan movie about a little girl who dresses up like a boy to dodge some sexist laws in taliban ruled Afghanistan. At the end she is unmasked and sold to an ulama, or something. Does anyone know the title?





belgianguy
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yes jesse I have the movie right here it's called osama
it was a golden globe winner




londoh
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I have to laugh so much about the conclusions people make after reading something in the newspaper. Daily life in Indo is quite different than these sour comments made by those Dutch who know exactly how the world must be ruled. In fact they know all, so clever those dikebuilding grocers (...searching for a nice "boomaap" eqquivalent)

Emoticon: Yes!



belgianguy
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well no londoh this isn't something we just read in newspapers...when I first got settled in my little east java town there was some nightlife (mainly karaoke), it was no problem to buy beer (there was a bintang dealership in town) but recently simple things like that are becoming a problem for the moslims here and it was all shut down, now there is only one (chinese) shop left that sells beer, and they also had to take down the (small) bintang sign
these are just small things but indicative of the mood here
the new bupati wants to make this a kota santri, and take away all the fun things (no hookers no booze no drugs) how boring



londoh
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Night life like karaoke, bars and the like are not part of Indonesian culture, but Western apalagi when Indonesians start to drink alcohol they become extremely boring, and often aggresive. When there is booze there will be also prostitution. If you want to have this kind of life around you, better move to a bigger town, Surabaya for example, many hookers, lots of dope and booze. Very simple.



Jesses
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"Night life like karaoke, bars and the like are not part of Indonesian culture"

What do you mean, Londoh? Indonesian people do not visit these kind of places? Since this kind of entertainment does not originate in Indonesia, it does not belong there?

I have some friends in Bogor who use to go to the Puncak in the weekend. Not because of the scenery, but because of the beer and the boobs. It surely is part of their culture.






Jantje
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On 04-05-2006 11:56 Jesses wrote:
but because of the beer and the boobs.

Emoticon: Nice



londoh
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On 04-05-2006 11:56 Jesses wrote:
I have some friends in Bogor who use to go to the Puncak in the weekend. Not because of the scenery, but because of the beer and the boobs. It surely is part of their culture.


Mr. Jesses,

I am not quite sure your friends represent the culture of 240 million Indonesians. Comparing with what I have seen in this country their behaviour is far from common. Don't mix up the things you like and want to do with how average people behave in Indonesia



Agung
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I guess there is something between "going for the boobs" and "punishing a woman because of having lipstick".... That is just behaving normal.

But, back to the subject.

Branding a woman as being a prostitute, because she has make up in her bag is a very serious issue and of course once more a step of this country on its way to becoming the next Afghanistan. Emoticon: Angry



Jesses
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"I am not quite sure your friends represent the culture of 240 million Indonesians"

No, presumably not, mr. Londoh. But I think you are too much occupied with the "average" Indonesian in this matter and with THE Indonesian culture as a fixed set of norms and values, and with it should be like. It doen't suit this topic.

But yes, I must admit: my own judgements about the norms and valuIes of some people might be a bit hasty (refering to the cowards and hypocrits and their "victims" Emoticon: Wink . I truly wish I could meet some of them.



Albert
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Jilbab, Burka and all other things.

The meaning of it is this; We Muslim man cannot control our lust therefore the woman should cover themselve. We cannot control their dig (penis).
It is not needed that we Muslim man should adjust, no woman should adjust to us horney guys.

If God wanted woman to be covered he would not had made them so beautiful (In general).




Wil je ook meester van je eigen leven zijn? http://www.goudenera.nl

Jesses
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We Muslim man cannot control our lust therefore the woman should cover themselve. We cannot control their dig (penis).

I didn't know muslim women could have a penis, too. This makes the whole sexual morality issue far more interesting Emoticon: Laugh out loud



Albert
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With that new law, girls wo are on the street in the evening are branded as a prostitute. What about them who are working in shift. They need to work in a factory at night. So when they go home they are being arrested as a protitute. All because of that stupid porno law.

Like I said many time in here they should pay more attention to the price of Nasi and Suker. But like always such sensitive subjects are carefully hidden from the public. But also in this forum. Nobody seems to be willing to talk about.

Also the Indonesian when buying a car.
They like to pay more attention to a little spot with corrosion on the care then about the quality of the car.
This you can put in many daily subjects in live.


Wil je ook meester van je eigen leven zijn? http://www.goudenera.nl

londoh
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I only compare with what I have experienced during my stay in Indonesia. I always lived in small towns and have seen many strange events, that were very contradicted with the things I have learned as being proper. But there is something like adoption to another culture (that is athing else many people in the Netherlands can talk for hours about) For me Indonesia is a very different society than the Netherlands, which country of non-believers became extremely anti-muslim the last couple of years. Please do mind that I am not a fan of this primitive believe, but in most parts of Indonesia one has to accept that the people are muslim, and behave according to that. Most of the people who write on this forum do not live in Indonesia. They just react after reading something from a newspaper and give their "opinion" even compare Indonesia with countries like Iran and Afghanistan, as if they know by heart what is going on there. I am always wondering what these people are telling about Islam when they stay in Indonesia. My "average" Indonesian will feel very insulted about so much rudeness that is full of intolerance and misunderstanding, if they will tell around the same ideas as they write about on this forum.

Lon



pretbek
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In the line of this story... I heard that a law forbids lady's in Jakarta to be out on the streets after 21:00. Indonesian men told me that quite often females with business jobs get in trouble (since they work late and sometimes also wear skirts). Of course, this law was initiated to prevent streetprostitution. But I can't seem to understand why this has to lead to restricting the freedom, and humiliation, of other people. (Also I'm not really sure whether wat I was told is true)
Is this normal politics in a country I'm just beginning to try to understand? (suppose it will take me longtime...)



pretbek
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sorry, didn't see the last messages.....



sidia
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On 04-05-2006 12:33 Jesses wrote:
"I am not quite sure your friends represent the culture of 240 million Indonesians"

No, presumably not, mr. Londoh. But I think you are too much occupied with the "average" Indonesian in this matter and with THE Indonesian culture as a fixed set of norms and values, and with it should be like. It doent suit this topic.


Amsterdam is welknown as Gaycity , and at "every" corner even schoolyards you can buy harddrugs.
But it doesnot mean that amsterdammers are gay or drugsaddicts .

Jakarta etc : First cafe/disco and ended with cafe/disco plus karaoke plus pijat ++ (brothel).
Send the FPI to close them if the police dont do their work.


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

sidia
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On 04-05-2006 13:02 londoh wrote:


My "average" Indonesian will feel very insulted about so much rudeness that is full of intolerance and misunderstanding, if they will tell around the same ideas as they write about on this forum.


Yesss, very ge-insulteerd Emoticon: Yes! Emoticon: Yes!


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

AnisJ
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S.lm.at s.mua yth.,

"With my personal remark on this issue, I am not intended to offend anybody ... but it struck me the outmost that some Islamist and also Christian believers have some weird ideas in 'their perception of females'.
  • To give an example:

    A while ago I had a discussion with an Arabian; he said that women, who smokes cigarettes are whores ( Emoticon: Confused Emoticon: Confused ).
    Then I said to him: "So men who are smoking cigarettes are pimps ........" Emoticon: Devil

    I think that men who state these things, show others more about themselves than about woman ......... Emoticon: Devil Emoticon: Devil Emoticon: Devil




  • 'Ahu kura ahia, mansia nia'


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