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londoh
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Anis Yth.
Searching for nails at low tide Anis ? Emoticon: Stupid Mr. SBY has been chosen in a democratic way by the Indonesian people, with quite a big majority. This is what we should respect. In Indonesia a retired soldier is considered as a citizen. He is still at the beginning of his term, we'll wait and see the results.

Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono:

Pendidikan:
= Akademi Angkatan Bersenjata RI (Akabri) tahun 1973
= American Language Course, Lackland, Texas AS, 1976
= Airbone and Ranger Course, Fort Benning , AS, 1976
= Infantry Officer Advanced Course, Fort Benning, AS, 1982-1983
= On the job training di 82-nd Airbone Division, Fort Bragg, AS, 1983
= Jungle Warfare School, Panama, 1983
= Antitank Weapon Course di Belgia dan Jerman, 1984
= Kursus Komando Batalyon, 1985
= Sekolah Komando Angkatan Darat, 1988-1989
= Command and General Staff College, Fort = Leavenwort,Kansas, AS
Master of Art (MA) dari Management Webster University, Missouri, AS

Karier:
- Dan Tonpan Yonif Linud 330 Kostrad (1974-1976)
- Dan Tonpan Yonif 305 Kostrad (1976-1977)
- Dan Tn Mo 81 Yonif Linud 330 Kostrad (1977)
- Pasi-2/Ops Mabrigif Linud 17 Kujang I Kostrad (1977-1978)
- Dan Kipan Yonif Linud 330 Kostrad (1979-1981)
- Paban Muda Sops SUAD (1981-1982)
- Komandan Sekolah Pelatih Infanteri (1983-1985)
- Dan Yonif 744 Dam IX/Udayana (1986-1988)
- Paban Madyalat Sops Dam IX/Udayana (1988)
- Dosen Seskoad (1989-1992)
- Korspri Pangab (1993)
- Dan Brigif Linud 17 Kujang 1 Kostrad (1993-1994)
- Asops Kodam Jaya (1994-1995)
- Danrem 072/Pamungkas Kodam IV/Diponegoro (1995)
- Chief Military Observer United Nation Peace Forces (UNPF) di Bosnia-Herzegovina (sejak awal November 1995)
- Kasdam Jaya (1996-hanya lima bulan)
- Pangdam II/Sriwijaya (1996-) sekaligus Ketua Bakorstanasda
- Ketua Fraksi ABRI MPR (Sidang Istimewa MPR 1998)
- Kepala Staf Teritorial (Kaster ABRI (1998-1999)
- Mentamben (sejak 26 Oktober 1999)
- Menko Polsoskam (Pemerintahan Presiden KH Abdurrahman Wahid)
- Menko Polkam (Pemerintahan Presiden Megawati Sukarnopotri) mengundurkan diri 11 Maret 2004





AnisJ
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Londoh yth.,

Quite an impressive lists you have presented, but .... the difference is: Running a country is another case then militairy management !!!
Probably the practicy serves the method: "To catch a thieves use another thief !!!"
This does not imply that SBY is a thief !!! No, it is the method !!!
Another question is interesting: "Is there a 'generation conflict' develping inside the army ???
The background of the national army is changed throughout the years: from
a sort of liberation army against the Dutch into an army with so many
generals with so many colonels and sergeants and so many different and diverse militairy sections; combined or not combined with cilvil, commercial
jobs .....
"Is it logical that the militairy is against federalism !!!"

Thanks for your feed-back, Londoh!!!

Greets ..... Anis.


'Ahu kura ahia, mansia nia'

londoh
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Hi Anis,

Running a country is something else than running Indonesia. Indonesia is a compicated affair, an archipelago with abt 17.000 islands. Inhabited by hundreds of different kind of people, one of the richest sources of raw materials in the world. It has belonged to the Dutch for hundreds of years, they made a fortune out of Indonesia. In 1942 Indonesia was occupied by the Japanese who were even worser than the Dutch and stole everything that could be stolen. In the Nethetlands you always hear those "Indische Nederlanders" about their suffering during the Japanese occupation, those colonials never mention the so-called (by them) "inlanders" of whom at least 300.000 fell victim when they worked, often forced, as romusha. How many women had to work as Ianfu ("comfort women') many never came back. The Indonesian population died of starvation during WW II because most of the rice was taken by Nippon, On August17th, 1945 Indonesia declared the long awaited dream : Independence. But the Dutch thought the Indonesians were not "ready" for freedom, they had not had enough, so they started a war. They did the same to Indonesia for which they hated (and still hate) the Germans so much, after "only" 5 years of occupation, Indonesia already had 350 years of "tamu tidak diundangi". This war costed the lives of more than 100.000 Indonesians, not all soldiers but many mothers and children.In this years the T.N.I. was formed, most of them unskilled as soldiers and with all kind of weapons, from bamboo spears to antique KNIL guns. Because of this heroic struggle the Indonesian Army has always been held in high respect in Indonesia. After the "souvereiniteitsoverdracht" the Dutch retired, but forced the Federal State RIS upon the Indonesians, this was abondened on August 17th, 1950 by Soekarno, when Indonesia became N.K.R.I. (Negri Kesatuan Republik Indonesia). Since that day a federal state got a very bad smell in Indonesian noses (not only the militairy) and they consider a Federal state as something 'kolonial'. The Dutch left a bankrupt country, they even forced the Indonesians for "herstelbetalingen", about 700 million guilders was paid until 1956.

Under Pres. Suharto the Army became a real powerhouse, with lots of financial interests in many of the countries businesses. The goverment of Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono has planned change this, and return the Army to itís position of defender of the nation.

Abt. Mr. SBY, it takes a rat to catch other rats, he knows about the army and he will be able to control and reorganize them, but that takes time. The problems in Indonesia are abundant. Indonesians are convinced they need someone from the miltairy to solve their problems, and not Mas Anis with his slogans.

Regards








AnisJ
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On 08-06-2005 15:20 londoh wrote:
Hi Anis,

Abt. Mr. SBY, it takes a rat to catch other rats, he knows about the army and he will be able to control and reorganize them, but that takes time. The problems in Indonesia are abundant. Indonesians are convinced they need someone from the miltairy to solve their problems, and not Mas Anis with his slogans.

Regards


Londoh yth., "How cynical you can be !!! I do not want to be compared with SBY !!!"
"How can you compare a mouse with an elephant ???"
Anyway one thing for sure I hope SBY can cope this: to make a difference in tasks of the military and the regular police forces, inside the country !!!
In the Moluccan case people witnessing that at certain times the army is fighting the regular police forces !!!
The army is not trusted, because people suspect them of a hidden agenda ; they consider the police more neutral !!!
Therefore I advise you to read this article:
www.icg.org/home/index.cfm?id=3190&1=1

Greets .... Anis.






'Ahu kura ahia, mansia nia'

AnisJ
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On 08-06-2005 15:20 londoh wrote:
Hi Anis,

Running a country is something else than running Indonesia. Indonesia is a compicated affair, an archipelago with abt 17.000 islands.


I do not know what you mean with this remark ??? Emoticon: Confused
If we talk this way we can talk everything right, what is wrong !!! Emoticon: Shut up!
What makes INDOnesia a different country then others ???: Emoticon: Devil


On 28-05-2005 15:30 Londoh wrote:
When we look at Indonesia in 2005, sesudah 60 tahun merdeka, we see a bankrupt country, bankrupt in the first place because of the corruption, second because of indolence. It is sad to see that after independence the Indonesians weren't capable to exploit their country in a profitable manner such as the Dutch always managed.
Today it is a sell-out of their natural recources, nearly no industrialisation, no new ideas, only lots of talking. They had a few good years under Suharto but that seems to be ages ago. It is such a pity that one of the richest countries in the world is in such a desolate condition.


"Is it not time after this period to give 'federalism' a go-ahead, because 'unitarism' had failed !!!
As you stated before we are not living in the years of independence anymore, we are living in the year 2 000 !!!


Greets ... Anis.


'Ahu kura ahia, mansia nia'

londoh
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Hi Anis,

Tidak perluk mancing dalam air keruh Emoticon: Yeah right!

Gruces



sahabat
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Anis,
Quit a discussion.
I only have a question.Are you asli and live on Jawa?
You know,Londoh is not Indonesian,he is orang asing and a person who survives and at the same time enjoys my country since a long time,,ya toch?
If you realise that ,you understand him better.Besides he sais things here on this forum which are no lies,but on the other hand ,we will always recognize people like him,though he is in a way a postive exception .The most I see on internet about people who live or planning to go to Indonesiah is sad people.
Sahabat



AnisJ
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Londoh yth.,

You are to fast in answering, whilst I was making my point !!!
There was some disturbance ... on the line.

As far as Sahabat: "What is your point actually" ???
Do you always have to live in a country to know about it; this argument was used for the racism in South-Africa; Israel, Russia ... Emoticon: Yeah right! !!! Or do you have to live on Jawa to know about INDOnesia ???
I think your attitude is something like: "Do not make a lot of fuss, one thing is for sure someday we all are going to die: "Do we go to hell or to heaven ?"
"How can you tell is someone is true or not true ???"
Or, is this a question that is to painful ?
Do you know for sure that Londoh is not INDOnesian ???
"As long as foreigners have all the fun in INDOnesia, Sahabat, would they ???"
Jagan pusing, ya toch .... Sahabat.

Sampai ketemu lagi; no offense, I hope ???

Greets .... Anis.


'Ahu kura ahia, mansia nia'

sahabat
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Anis,
Haha,you know I feel to answer in Bahasa ,but there are rules so I have to respek..But if you don't mind I will not continue this discuss.Say what you like to say.
Sahabat will never allow people hurting him,will never start discussions till the bottom.
To me Internet is a way to relax.If I find worth it to reply,ok,if not ,I continue seeing other mssges which have my sympathy.If there is nothing else to see in this forum I click on other sites ,and if I think it is enough,I switch off my pc.
Baik baik ya Sahabat



londoh
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Hi Anis,

You made a few points on which I posted a reaction. If you just pick out a part of a sentence, I don't know what to say anymore.

I consider a discussion rather an exchange of ideas than being right or wrong. The last thing I will do it to tell what is good for Indonesia. I'll leave that for other Dutchies who are more into colonial thinking than I am. I am also not into a game with words as I consider the topic as serious.

Regards,
Londoh





Sepp Buys
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Dear all,

I find the name "The United Islands of Indonesia", still the best name.

Sepp



AnisJ
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Sahabat yth.,

If you choose that way .... it is your choise !!! But do not play: ' Hide and seek !!!
When I was a kid I had a lot of dogs most of them are for a good fight: face to face with other neighbouring dogs but .... one doggie alway is coming from behind and have his little bite, with the other dogs in their fight !!!
Sebenarnya Sahabat punya artinya dari asli apa???
'What do you mean with asli , Sahabat ???
People have techniques and methods that do not divers from animals; except people have the possibility to think !!!
And people have something they called: Adat; when people do not behave they say: 'Orang tida tau adat !!!'.

Londoh yth.,

I am really suprise with your reaction, for these are the words you, yourself had said.
But what I actually, in general want to say is that: 'What ever you see/talk/analyse INDOnesia, you can not neglect the fact that in every way INDOnesia is also a colonial product.
That is why, you will have to deal with these questions !!!
Regards,

Anis.


'Ahu kura ahia, mansia nia'

AnisJ
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Dear all/s.mua yth.,


I recall a song about Nusantara sung by Brury Pesulima , the lyrics are:

N U S A N T A R A.

Kuharap kau tak kan
cemburu
Melihat hidupku
Hidupku bebas selalu
kawanku
Tiada yang memburu

Di Nusantara yang
indah rumahku
Kamu harus tau
Tanahpermata tak
kenal kecewa
Di khatulistiwa

Hutannya lebat
Seperti rambutku
Hutannya lebat
Seperti rambutku
Gunungya tinggi
Seperti hatiku (2 x)

Lautnya luas
Seperti jiwaku
Lautnya luas
Seperti jiwaku
Alamnya ramah )
Seperti senyumku )

Tanahnya subur )
Seperti tubuhku )
Unggasnya bebas )
Seperti hidupku )

Yok Kuswoyo


Greets ..... Anis.




'Ahu kura ahia, mansia nia'

sidia
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Hi Anis ,
ondertiteling graag.
About the name of -----

Pse see :
SUMPAH PEMUDA
One motherland (Indonesia)
One nation (Indonesia)
One language (Indonesia)

Concern ONLY the Indonesian Not the expat , tourist what soever.



Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

AnisJ
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Sidia yth.,

Rasa serasa mas Sid !!!
Biar jauh dari mata, dekat dihati !!!
Tak usa ajar, ilmu pancuri buat orang pancuri, kan ???
Do you mean expats like donkisotRemoved to prevent your adress from being spammed. Click this to go to the user profile.tiscali.nl ???
Is there also dictatorship INDOnesia-style on this forum ???
Belanda bilang: "Schijn democratie"/Democrati Tersembunji.
It look almost like the Stalinistic Times when INDOnesia was friends with Russia, with Chroestjov !!!

Silahkan .... Anis.


'Ahu kura ahia, mansia nia'

sidia
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Their land , their people , their problems, their solutions.

about the outsiders ? : who do they think they are ?


boleh kan ?


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

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dear all,

There is a shifting in the topic. But I believe since globalization, we also have to think as the citizen of the world as well, for global problems.
Sidia, I believe we should be grateful of the countries who don't think that Indonesia's problems are for Indonesian only, like in Tsunami, etc.
Soempah Pemoeda, in fact, should define, what is "Bangsa Indonesia". Because it seems that the interpretation of it only gave birth to 'Asli' dan 'Tidak Asli' term.
And I believe whereever someone comes from, and whoever, we shouldn't be prejudiced. Expat, Indonesia Asli - well only fate destines them to be born that way in this lifetime. And life is of course too short to make a fuss about things like that. There are things more crucial to think about: poverty, diseases, and such.
And in my opinion, Sepp, the name Indonesia is not bad - Emoticon: Smile what is in the name? At least it was choosen by the founding fathers of this country.

WJ




sidia
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Johny

if you see sumpah pemuda
there are no difference between Pribumi and Non Pri.
problems is that people seem forget.

9tidak ada perbedaan antara Pri dan non Pri.
If they feel different that can become a problem

greetings from taman anggrek.
rainy jakarta ( sedang libur=Urlaub machen)


Bisa dicek mas . http://omsid.multiply.com/

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dear Sidia,

Hehe, almost everyday I pass Taman Anggrek on my way to Citraland!
And yeah, people forget so easily. And there is a definite different in the system - it's harder to deal with the bureaucratic system for what people call
'Non Pri'. Not only the feeling but real. I would love to give example, but it will seem like a personal journal.

Mit Freundlichen Grussen,

WJ



sidik
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Sidia,

In the Soempah Pemoeda there is no difference between pri or non-pribumi. But in real life it is different. Do you know about the selections for education? I'm sure Johny can give you more examples.


tunawisma, tunakarya, tunamasalah

AnisJ
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Johny yth.,

I see you several times on this forum, for somebody that looks young ('How old are you actualy' [not necassarily precise under 20 or above]), you are clinging yourself to a lot of topics already {Ini orang dia maju sepat !!!}; very good Johny do your thing !!!
Tell the members what is on your mind !!!
"Indeed this topic is shifting from its orinal meaning, very good John" !!!
But I think ,you and other members, have to explain for outsiders the relation between Nusantara and Sumpa Pemuda !!!
I have already received messages about it !!!
What made me puzzeled is the fact that most of the better educated INDOnesians except without any blink of the eye INDOnesia ???
Whilst INDOnesia is, as I stated before, of foreign origin !!!

Sampai ketemu lagi/Till we meet again ...... Anis.


'Ahu kura ahia, mansia nia'

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dear Anis,

Well, I am younger than the mountain but older than the trees..(I am kidding, I am just quoting John Denver's song). You can see how old I am by seeing at the forum member age.
I have made a statement..what's in a name?

WJ

dear Sidik,

Thank you for your kind comments. But I am afraid what I know is less than what you know.

WJ




sidik
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Johny,

You are wise and humble Emoticon: Worship . I understand that you don't want to make this forum a personal journal, but those words also mean ....................


tunawisma, tunakarya, tunamasalah

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dear Sidik,

Emoticon: Smile I am not at all wise nor humble. And what all my words mean?

WJ



sidik
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Johny,



On 06-07-2005 12:27 johny251976 wrote:
dear Sidia,


Non Pri. Not only the feeling but real. I would love to give example, but it will seem like a personal journal.


WJ



tunawisma, tunakarya, tunamasalah


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